Official Luthiers Forum!
http://www.luthiersforum.com/forum/

12 fret to body OLF SJ - downright stupid?
http://www.luthiersforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10101&t=23664		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  Geordie Adams [ Wed Sep 02, 2009 12:18 pm ]
Post subject:  12 fret to body OLF SJ - downright stupid?
hi all
I have an urge to build a 12 fret to body SJ with cutaway.
Is this irrational, unreasonable, or downright stupid.
Thinking back to Steve Saville's lovely baritones with 27.5" scale got me thinking about the bridge position
on this body shape/size with the very rounded lower bout and that there might be some benefit other than
visual from placing it more centrally in the lower bout.
With the addition of a cutaway still giving access "up there".
Your thoughts please - don't hold back now.
Now the QUESTION
What else would you move other than the bridge / plate to make this work.
regards
Geordie
Author:  woody b [ Wed Sep 02, 2009 12:36 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 12 fret to body OLF SJ - downright stupid?
Instead of using an OLF-SJ shape, I'd just start with a blank piece of paper...so to speak. You can keep the curves and dimensions about the same. I'd split the difference and make the body ~1 fret longer. This moves the bridge, bridgeplate and bracing the distance of ~1 fret. I make a 13 fret "LJ" (I call it a little jumbo) that's 15.5" lower bout and 21" body length. I started with a fingerboard, and a bridge, positioned them on a piece of 1/4" plywood. Then I drew out my body, located the soundhole, braces ect.
Author:  Pat Foster [ Wed Sep 02, 2009 12:38 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 12 fret to body OLF SJ - downright stupid?
Geordie,

Sounds reasonable to me. I'm planning a 12 fret cutaway with a shorter scale for a guy who has shoulder problems and he plays jazz and blues.

You'll have to move the bracing too, so that the bridge straddles the lower two legs of the x-brace. I like to have the two lower corners of the bridge, those closest to the tail, sit right over the lower legs of the x. You might have to fiddle with the angle of the intersection of the two x-braces as well. Have a look at the UMGF in the technical section, if I remember, at the thread showing photos of bracing.

Pat
Author:  TonyKarol [ Wed Sep 02, 2009 12:38 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 12 fret to body OLF SJ - downright stupid?
Not silly at all .. think 12 fret slope dread .. done all the time. I built a 13 fret jumbo size for a client a couple years back, very nice. I have a 13 fret 12 string on the go now.

As for moving things .. you need to either move the whole X back , or make a longer bridge - the bridge wings HAVE to sit on the X for stability, and tone transfer. Bracing is a system, not just one thing. Draw it out and see ....
Author:  Pat Foster [ Wed Sep 02, 2009 2:39 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 12 fret to body OLF SJ - downright stupid?
Pat Foster wrote:
Geordie,

Sounds reasonable to me. I'm planning a 12 fret cutaway with a shorter scale for a guy who has shoulder problems and he plays jazz and blues.

You'll have to move the bracing too, so that the bridge straddles the lower two legs of the x-brace. I like to have the two lower corners of the bridge, those closest to the tail, sit right over the lower legs of the x. You might have to fiddle with the angle of the intersection of the two x-braces as well. Have a look at the UMGF in the technical section, if I remember, at the thread showing photos of bracing.

Pat


I should add that the photos on UMGF were taken with bright lights inside the body of completed guitars. The bracing and bridges show up in profile and its easy to see the relationship between them. They're mostly Martins, but are pretty typical, and I think Martin knows what they're doing. :D

Pat
Author:  Alan Carruth [ Wed Sep 02, 2009 2:53 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 12 fret to body OLF SJ - downright stupid?
I built a 12 fret 12-string last year on my 16" Small Jumbo platform that was a killer. It's the first guitar I've made that I was not able to sing over. I used a short scale on it, 24.5", to keep the octave G-string breakage down. BTW, that's the 12-string top on the video.
Author:  bluescreek [ Wed Sep 02, 2009 3:22 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 12 fret to body OLF SJ - downright stupid?
Nothing stupid at all about it. Gibson used 12 13 and 14 frets on the same body . Martin did the Norm Blake and David Crosby we frets on a 14 fret body , just adjust the bracing , use a 19 fret board , short scale , and move the the sound hole accordingly. This moves the bridge down more to the sweet spot in the lower bout. You may be more than pleasantly surprised .
Author:  Fred Tellier [ Wed Sep 02, 2009 4:15 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 12 fret to body OLF SJ - downright stupid?
I am interested in what martin did with the top bracing on the Norman Blake 000. I have some interest in building something similar, the idea of the bridge more centered in the lower bout seems like it would help the sound.

Fred
Author:  Geordie Adams [ Wed Sep 02, 2009 4:21 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 12 fret to body OLF SJ - downright stupid?
hello gentlemen
seems you all agree with this one, thanks for your encouraging [:Y:]
OLF SJ 25.4 s/l.
As I only play in dropped tunings some quiet low and this s/l and 13 gauge works for me.
There is only one thing I'm really unclear about and thats sound hole placement.
Is there a positional relationship to consider between sound hole, saddle and or 12 fret other than fret count / aesthetics ?.
many thanks
Geordie
Author:  Steve W [ Wed Sep 02, 2009 11:24 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 12 fret to body OLF SJ - downright stupid?
Here's my take on a 12-fret SJ. I started with the OLF plans and scaled the body down slightly so it has a 15 inch lower bout. I've made several similar to this one, which has a redwood top.

One nice thing about just building guitars for fun is that you can try anything you want.

Steve
Page 1 of 1 All times are UTC - 5 hours
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group
http://www.phpbb.com/