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| Bending a 2x6 on Edge Without Heat? http://www.luthiersforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10101&t=23021 |
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| Author: | npalen [ Thu Jul 09, 2009 10:01 am ] |
| Post subject: | Bending a 2x6 on Edge Without Heat? |
http://www.flutedbeams.com/home.html Any of you guys messed with this stuff? Any uses in luthery? |
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| Author: | Quine [ Thu Jul 09, 2009 3:39 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Bending a 2x6 on Edge Without Heat? |
Wow...cool stuff Looking at that boat gave me a major case of the "gotta-haves" As for guitar uses.....maybe?? I bet it would be good for bowl shaped lutes or mandolin bodies. I've also heard of people using really thick sides on accoustics.....two or three ply. I think the idea is to make a really stiff rim so the top vibrates better. It might be a solution for that style of building How about rims for harp type instruments? You could get pretty crazy with that stuff |
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| Author: | StevenWheeler [ Thu Jul 09, 2009 7:31 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Bending a 2x6 on Edge Without Heat? |
I did a dread in Cherry using the Compwood. Great guitar. Did a lot of odd things on that build, so attributing the sound to the exceptionaly stiff sides alone might be a mistake, but they sure didn't hurt. Huge sound, lots of overtones, clear and balanced. I got lucky on that one. The Compwood shrinks in length as it dries. I used a dread form and bent the side at 3/8". That's right, "side", one piece all the way around. It finished out at about the same dimensions as an OM. I didn't use a tail block, didn't need one. No linings either. I will use the product again. Some pics. |
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| Author: | npalen [ Thu Jul 09, 2009 8:33 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Bending a 2x6 on Edge Without Heat? |
Steven--What about using for a non-kerfed lining in a "normal" guitar? I would think that the lineal schrinkage would be an issue where it's being glued to dry wood. I understand that the product is shipped to the end user at @25% MC. What are your thoughts regarding the shrinkage after using it for sides? |
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| Author: | StevenWheeler [ Thu Jul 09, 2009 10:01 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Bending a 2x6 on Edge Without Heat? |
I've got a couple of guitars that I've used the Compwood for solid linings. You cut it to size and bend it in a form and allow it to dry. You don't do any assembly until it's dry so there is no problem when you glue it. The Compwood is still a bit flexible when dry, this makes it easy to install the linings. I slide the sides down in the mold so I'm clamping the sides between the mold and the lining. When I bent the dread side, I started with a piece the same length as my form. When I wrestled the wood into the form, it seemed to stretch. As the wood dried, I tightened the form until it was closed. That took about 3 days. After 3 or 4 more days, the wood read about 9% on the meter and fit loosely in the form. The original length of the sides was around 64 1/2", the final dimension was around 62". If you were to do a standard 2 piece side, shrinkage would not be an issue. This guitar has been together for about a year now and shows no sign of movement. No checking, warping, cracking, nothing of the sort. Until you pick it up you would have no idea that it was not of standard construction. It weighs close to 7 lbs., fortunatly it exhibits none of the standard heavy acoustic guitar sound attributes. I gave my last piece of the wood to my friend John Ressler. When he builds a guitar with it, we'll be able to make some comparisons. |
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| Author: | Quine [ Fri Jul 10, 2009 1:14 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Bending a 2x6 on Edge Without Heat? |
That looks pretty cool with no butt joint or end graft How is it to bend? You can really just bend it by hand?? Does it just bend like plastic or do you have to ease it into shape slowly? |
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| Author: | StevenWheeler [ Fri Jul 10, 2009 5:21 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Bending a 2x6 on Edge Without Heat? |
How easy the Compwood bends is dependant on the size of the piece. If you were using it for bindings, it bends like plastic. When I bent some for linings, I pulled it into the form with ratcheting bar clamps. Leverage is a factor. If you are bending a 5/16"x5/8" piece 32" long for a lining, it is easy to tie it into a square knot. Putting a 3" radius on the very end will give you problems. The wood will crack if you rush the bend. Like any other wood working, you have to be aware of the direction of the grain. When I use this product again, I'll use an inside form. Stuffing it into an outside mold was a bit of a challange. You'll notice from the picture that the guitar is kind of thin. The wood started to crack in the upper bout bend on one side. Fortunately the crack was only about an inch long so I just reduced the depth of the body to eliminate the crack. Another thing you can do to make it bend easier is to get the wood wet, or shall I say wetter. I have taken dried pieces of this product and thrown it in a tub of water and was able to rebend it like it was fresh out of the package. |
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| Author: | Flori F. [ Sat Jul 11, 2009 9:25 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Bending a 2x6 on Edge Without Heat? |
As Steven said, this stuff could work well for linings. It could also be ideal for armrests, but the limited selection of woods might make it difficult to match one's chosen binding scheme. |
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| Author: | Chris Mroz [ Tue Jul 14, 2009 9:26 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Bending a 2x6 on Edge Without Heat? |
Steven, I compressed that Cherry for you but seem to have lost your contact info. I just came across your post and pictures of your Cherry Dread. Very nice looking instrument. I’m working on a thick sided Walnut myself where I’ll leave the area with linings thick, and hollow out the center a bit to lighten it up. Not sure the hollowing is necessary, more because of tradition. I'm going to try it your way too. I’m thinking the thick sides and hollowing will give the guitar good percussive characteristics for finger style percussive playing. I use the same technique in snare drums and it has become a fantastic product. Anyway, I’d sure like to display your guitar pictures on my Wood Art gallery page at my site FlutedBeams or ExtremeWoodBending. Would that be OK? If so I could save it right from this forum page, unless you want to send me something. Thanks. Chris Mroz. |
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| Author: | StevenWheeler [ Wed Jul 15, 2009 8:06 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Bending a 2x6 on Edge Without Heat? |
Hi Chris, Good to hear from you. I thought you might show up for the discussion. I'm amazed that there hasn't been more experimentation with your product by the lutherie community. On one hand we sure are into our exotic woods. On the other, there is a lot of experimentation in all aspects of building with quite a few people working on stiffer sides for their guitars. You won't find many guitars with sides as stiff as this Cherry dread of mine. Everyone who plays it is very pleased with the sound and are amazed by the overtones. The bass just rips out of this thing, no boominess at all. As stated before, lots of experimentation on this box so attributing all the sound to the hard sides is questionable. That's why I gave a piece of your wood to a more experienced builder to use. It is my feeling that the super stiff sides are a big part of the equation. One question for you. How do you control the shrinkage of the material? Was it my use of an outside mold and air drying? I notice most things you bend have inside forms and get kiln dried. Feel free to use the pictures. I can take better ones if you like. One of the members here was kind enough to do a Photograpy 101 thread which helped my picture taking tremendously. Steve |
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| Author: | npalen [ Wed Jul 15, 2009 9:39 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Bending a 2x6 on Edge Without Heat? |
Thanks for stopping by, Chris! |
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