Thank you Alexandru for your clear and precise answer.
thank you also everybody.
You made me change my mind, it will be option #1
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| Author: | Antonio [ Thu Feb 19, 2009 4:28 am ] |
| Post subject: | Kind of solera? |
From my research about the solera, I have found that there are those who built his solera in a way that is slightly hollowed so that the soundboard will take a gentle domed shape. Others use a work board shim made from a sheet of cork that is glued (with tape) to the solera; in this case you don’t need to hollow the solera. This seems an easier way to do it. I also read that in the first case, when gluing the curved braces, if too much pressure is applied it is possible that it leaves visible marks on the top surface of the soundboard. The option for the 2nd is to glue the braces with a flexible slat outside the solera. I am inclined to choose the 2nd option. From you experience what do you find to work best? Thank you |
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| Author: | Alexandru Marian [ Thu Feb 19, 2009 6:55 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Kind of solera? |
You will get an imprint of the braces anyway, if your top is thin, app. 2m.. Thicker tops of 2.5mm or so do not show the brace imprint. This imprint is easily sanded out though - and I expect you would be leaving some 0.1mm extra for the final cleanup and tuning anyway. The cork method I think read it was proposed by Cumpiano, and I doubt many people use it to glue braces. I think you can actually split a top easily with a strong gobar system if it is thin and the braces not too slanted, like in a flamenco... It works OK for the assembly part, and I did it this way with my first whiel the braces were glued in a seprate dish. Since then I incorporated that dish in my solera. I am certain most builders will agree that a dished / hollowed solera is the best way to do the glue-up and assembly. I also read your "curved braces" - this is OK only for the transverse bars. The spanish way is not to radius the fan braces, but to press them in the dish. If you'd pre-radius them, especially the flat and wide type, you would be creating a lot of runout. If you really do not want stressed components, you can find, with some patience, brace stock that splits with a slight curve to it. |
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| Author: | WaddyThomson [ Thu Feb 19, 2009 6:50 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Kind of solera? |
What Alex said! Take the time to make a good solera. You will really appreciate how much easier your build will go, if you have a solid support system under the top for gluing fans. |
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| Author: | Tai Fu [ Thu Feb 19, 2009 7:34 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Kind of solera? |
Or if it's too much hassle to make a solera then you can always buy one from Luthier's Suppliers (their's are the best, waterproof and not prone to warping, and reasonably priced too) |
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| Author: | WaddyThomson [ Thu Feb 19, 2009 10:42 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Kind of solera? |
I don't think Luthier Suppliers sells Soleras. They sell radius dishes, but that's not the same thing. |
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| Author: | Antonio [ Fri Feb 20, 2009 4:01 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Kind of solera? |
Thank you Alexandru for your clear and precise answer. thank you also everybody. You made me change my mind, it will be option #1
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| Author: | Tai Fu [ Fri Feb 20, 2009 4:43 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Kind of solera? |
WaddyThomson wrote: I don't think Luthier Suppliers sells Soleras. They sell radius dishes, but that's not the same thing. Sorry, my bad... I thought they were the same, |
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| Author: | TonyFrancis [ Fri Feb 20, 2009 5:12 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Kind of solera? |
- |
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| Author: | Antonio [ Fri Feb 20, 2009 6:34 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Kind of solera? |
Tony, I have been told that the ideal is MDF |
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| Author: | Geordie Adams [ Fri Feb 20, 2009 8:04 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Kind of solera? |
hi Tony I am using a compass plane on MDF (though I suspect marine ply would be best.) and bracing the solera on the back through its length and across the lower bout to stop it from warping. Geordie |
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| Author: | Don Fera [ Fri Feb 20, 2009 8:18 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Kind of solera? |
TonyFrancis wrote: What tools do you guys use to hollow your solera? And what wood do you like to use? Ply, MDF, Chipboard? Eugene Clark gave a presentation on this very subject. He talked about a radius with profiled sides vs. doming the top but the sides remaining straight. He is a proponent of the later option, as was Torres and the Spanish tradition which followed him. He said that went to the lumber yard and picked out some 2X6" redwood boards that were dry and straight, glued 3 of them together at the lower and upper bout with the center board extending out to support the fingerboard. This was scooped out to the depth of the dome within the shape of the plantillia. This was written up as an article in the Winter 07' issue (#92) of American Lutheriehttp://www.luth.org/backissues/al89-92/al92.htm. An interesting read and Mr. Clark was quite persuasive in the actual presentation... I still have not gotten around to making one, but it is high on my list of fixtures to make. Don Fera |
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| Author: | Stephen Boone [ Fri Feb 20, 2009 9:48 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Kind of solera? |
One benefit of using baltic birch or some other finely laminated plywood is that as you carve away the bowl shape the veneer lines are exposed. Keeping these lines straight and neat helps to guide you as you carve and helps maintain a fair curve. |
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| Author: | douglas ingram [ Fri Feb 20, 2009 10:14 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Kind of solera? |
The Courtnall book "Making Master Guitars" has an excellent tutorial on making a solara for straight face sides. Bogdanovich has a good tutorial in his book "Classical Guitar Making" for a solara which uses the radius face side. Neil Ostberg has an excellent online tutorial http://mysite.verizon.net/nostberg/ His doming is larger than usual. Not a problem, just that you should be aware. Your choice of material isn't as important as applying good construction thinking to the choices that you make. If you're keen on building classical guitars, then good solara is really worth the effort, and its not really that hard to do. |
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| Author: | WaddyThomson [ Fri Feb 20, 2009 11:34 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Kind of solera? |
The Courtnall Solera is really not that hard to do. I made mine that way first and it looked like this. Attachment: DSC03602 (Large).JPG It was after that, that I learned of the raised lower bout of the Romanillos Solera, so I changed it to this. Attachment: DSC03639 (Large).JPG I did all the hollowing out with a slightly curved cabinet scraper and a round sanding block that I made with a radiused 2x4 that I made from a template. It takes a little while, but it is not hard. I opted for keeping the outside 15 mm or so to remain at 90* to the sides. In my way of thinking, that applies a little of the bell theory to the top. |
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| Author: | WaddyThomson [ Fri Feb 20, 2009 11:57 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Kind of solera? |
I was going to edit, but time ran out. I found some errors in the solera after I started laying things out, so I had to make changes. Bondo is your friend!  Now, it looks like this.Attachment: P1000288 (Large).JPG
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