Peter I'm with Joe and just want to congratulate you on a great looking guitar!
![[:Y:]](./images/smilies/smiley20.gif "Thumbs Up")
![[clap]](./images/smilies/smiley32.gif "adulations")
| Official Luthiers Forum! http://www.luthiersforum.com/forum/ |
|
| Latest build and a couple of finish and tone questions... http://www.luthiersforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10101&t=21094 |
Page 1 of 1 |
| Author: | My Dog Bob [ Tue Feb 17, 2009 4:56 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Latest build and a couple of finish and tone questions... |
Here's my latest: African Mahogany, Engelman spruce, European Walnut neck, Ebony trim, Handmade rossette, Garnet Shellac for finish. Finish Question: Can you readily apply lacquer over de-waxed shellac (not this guitar, just question in general)? Up to what thickness shellac undercoat can you apply lacquer finish coats over? Tone Question: This particular guitar came out great but I want to add slightly to the high-end frequencies. The bass is great, the volume is great, on the next one, I am thinking either a slightly thicker top or taller skinnier braces to help with the high frequencies... any recommendations or thoughts of what you folks do, I don't want to choke the guitar or kill the bass any more than I have to. I realize this is all a trade-off, but would one way hurt the bass and volume less. Any thoughts? Thanks, Peter |
|
| Author: | Michael Dale Payne [ Tue Feb 17, 2009 5:16 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Latest build and a couple of finish and tone questions... |
In regards to nitro over dewaxed shellac; Without any problems. That said it is a good idea to give a tooth to it with a light 400p sanding. Also if the guitar was 100% shellac finished to final thickness. Adding enough nitro over the top that can be leveled out is adding thickness and dampening to the guitar. You may want to reconsider this move if you are thinking about re finishing a completed finish. besides shellac is infinitely recondition-able. The same is not true for nitro. |
|
| Author: | My Dog Bob [ Tue Feb 17, 2009 5:56 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Latest build and a couple of finish and tone questions... |
Not looking to lacquer over a full thickness shellac finish, i am just thinking about french polishing the tops and using the same schellac to seal the wood under and over the pore filler on the back and sides. Another benefit would be the aged amber appearance the shellac gives the purfling (like the top). I don't want the top to be amber without the rest of the guitar's lighter areas having a similar color (even if not so dark).. This sound ok? |
|
| Author: | jordan aceto [ Tue Feb 17, 2009 5:59 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Latest build and a couple of finish and tone questions... |
pzwinakis wrote: Not looking to lacquer over a full thickness shellac finish, i am just thinking about french polishing the tops and using the same schellac to seal the wood under and over the pore filler on the back and sides. Another benefit would be the aged amber appearance the shellac gives the purfling (like the top). I don't want the top to be amber without the rest of the guitar's lighter areas having a similar color (even if not so dark).. This sound ok? Yep, lots of people do that. Shellac is just about the nicest way to warm up a finish. |
|
| Author: | Joe Sustaire [ Tue Feb 17, 2009 7:13 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Latest build and a couple of finish and tone questions... |
Peter, I'm not experienced enough to comment on improving the trebles, but just wanted to say how much I like the looks of that guitar. Great job! Joe |
|
| Author: | Hesh [ Tue Feb 17, 2009 7:34 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Latest build and a couple of finish and tone questions... |
Peter I'm with Joe and just want to congratulate you on a great looking guitar!
|
|
| Author: | My Dog Bob [ Tue Feb 17, 2009 7:54 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Latest build and a couple of finish and tone questions... |
Thanks for the compliment! Obviously, I am a Django freak and am living in the past... WAY in the past... |
|
| Author: | sebastiaan56 [ Wed Feb 18, 2009 1:29 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Latest build and a couple of finish and tone questions... |
Hi Peter, I cant answer your question about the bracing but what you suggest makes sense to me, as you note how much? I have a few questions. Did you use ladder bracing? did you angle the lower bout? if so, to what angle? What strings did you use? maybe string choice may give you the sound you are after? I have one of these in my future. What you have done looks really nice. I particularly like the finish. |
|
| Author: | SteveSmith [ Wed Feb 18, 2009 7:07 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Latest build and a couple of finish and tone questions... |
Very cool looking guitar. Do you have more pictures? |
|
| Author: | My Dog Bob [ Wed Feb 18, 2009 11:54 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Latest build and a couple of finish and tone questions... |
Yes the guitar is ladder braced exactly like the originals. I'm not really interested in changing the design more than I am interested in refining it for my tastes. The heel and body is tapered in (so the bottom of the heel and body is narrower at the back) The difference from top to bottom is 10mm or so. Strings: Only ones I use are Argentine 10's (silver plated copper over steel) they give the proper gypsy tone and are the most widely used for this style of guitar (as far as I know). I have found that the 11's create too much tension and dampen the guitars voice. If you're gonna create one of these guitars, I would highly recommend not trying to reinvent the wheel and go changing the design. The guitar's design is so well thought out and copying it would serve you well. There are fairly good plans out there.. Regards, Peter |
|
| Author: | Alan Carruth [ Wed Feb 18, 2009 3:27 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Latest build and a couple of finish and tone questions... |
I don't have any experience with this design, so you have to take any advice I give with a grain of salt. In fact, that's ALWAYS a good idea. A larger soundhole would be the first thing to come to my mind, but you probably don't want to do that. This would raise the pitch of the 'main air' resonance, at least, and allow it to 'breath' easier. Adding a 'port' in the side would have something of the same effect. I tend to use a thicker top to get better trebles. It adds some weight, and thus can, in theory, cut down on overall volume, but in practice it's not such a big problem, I think. It will tend to cost you some bass, since the 'main top' resonance will be a bit higher in pitch, and there will be less air moved through the hole at the 'main air' pitch too. You can get around this by 'tuning' the back so that the 'main back' tap tone is closer to the 'main top' pitch. This helps the top to move air at the lower frequencies, and is still effective (although less so) even when the back is up against your body as you play. If the back ends up about a semitone higher in pitch then the top you'll get about the most effect from this tuning, with little chance of problems such as 'wolf' notes. If you do make the top thicker, don't get carried away. Remember that the stiffness goes as the cube of the thickness, so that leaving a given top 25% thicker makes it about twice as stiff, but only 25% heavier, of course. The tap tone pitch goes up a bit, and there are some other likely beneficial effects too. For one thing, it's less likely to fold! Note that you can cut down a little on the size of the bracing with a thicker top. The weight saving there isn't much, but what the heck. |
|
| Author: | truckjohn [ Wed Feb 18, 2009 11:39 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Latest build and a couple of finish and tone questions... |
If you just want a little more treble..... How about just lessening the slope of the saddle piece from Bass to Treble -- the less drop off the saddle has from Bass to Treble -- the more trebly it gets.... till the Treble strings are even with the Bass strings.... and it sounds like a Jangly Student Guitar. Mmmmm Jangly. You don't have to go too much -- a "Standard" profile has the E about 0.025" taller than the e. Make another saddle insert with a 0.015" height difference -- you will definitely hear a BIG difference immediately. Just adjust the taper a swipe or two across sandpaper at a time until it sounds right. Good luck John |
|
| Page 1 of 1 | All times are UTC - 5 hours |
| Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group http://www.phpbb.com/ |
|