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methods for undercutting fretwire for bound fretboards
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Author:  Heath Blair [ Wed Dec 17, 2008 12:01 am ]
Post subject:  methods for undercutting fretwire for bound fretboards
ive seen a couple of little tools for this task that range in price from about $50-100, which seems a bit spendy at this point. they may well be worth it, but im wondering what methods you guys use. can i just go to town with a file? are there any home made jigs someone might like to share?
Author:  Rod True [ Wed Dec 17, 2008 12:09 am ]
Post subject:  Re: methods for undercutting fretwire for bound fretboards
Heath, I've used files, my stationary sander and flush cut nippers all with decent success. These will work, you just need to be careful when using something like a file not to round the underside of the fret as it will show. Same with the sander.

I've now got the fret tang nipper from Stew-Mac and let me tell you, it's well worth the $$. And this is coming from someone who will build any and every other tool that I can. I don't like to spend $ on tools if I can either make one or can find a very good alternative, but the Stew-Mac fret tang nipper is simply worth the money and it's $44.95 so pretty reasonable for the specialized tool that it is.

Again, this coming from a real cheep skate.
Author:  David Collins [ Wed Dec 17, 2008 12:31 am ]
Post subject:  Re: methods for undercutting fretwire for bound fretboards
What Rod said. If you don't plan on doing a fret job more than once or twice, you can get by with files, grinders, flush cutters, etc. Or you can get a set of regular non-customized nippers for $20-$25 at the hardware store and mill the bead groove in them yourself. Buying it from StewMac is like paying them $20 to do the grinding for you, and well worth it as the slot needs to be precise if you want a clean cut.

If you can't afford the StewMac ones, I wouldn't bother making your own. Just use flush cutters and/or a file, and make sure you have some extra wire to allow for bad cuts or file strokes. If you plan on doing this more than a few times though, investing in a tang nipper is well worth it.
Author:  Jim Watts [ Wed Dec 17, 2008 12:49 am ]
Post subject:  Re: methods for undercutting fretwire for bound fretboards
I just did that today. I use the Stewmac fret tang nipper. This tool works very well.
Author:  Mike OMelia [ Wed Dec 17, 2008 1:27 am ]
Post subject:  Re: methods for undercutting fretwire for bound fretboards
laughing6-hehe I'm laughing because I bought the fret nipper because at the time, it looked like something I was going to need since the fret slots did not go all the way across the board. But when I started fretting, I forgot what that tool was for. So I pulled it out and messed around with some fret wire until it hit me. Yes, you could file or grind or nip away the uneeded stock, but this little tool does such a good job! What I did notice is that it is better to take smaller cuts, creeping up to the desired cut. This tool tends to pull the wire in the direction of the cut, so flip it arround for the final cut and the fret comes out perfectly straight. This does beg the question of why not use the tang nippers to do it. But this tool can almost cut it flush, the nippers cannot, and thus the use of a file is required (risking rounding the under side of the fret) when using tang nippers. Very little filing if any at all is required when using this tool.

Good tool, enjoyable to use, requires some technique.

Gonna use it over and over again.

Mike

PS: Perhaps someone should post pics of the tools being discussed? Yup, I'm too tired to do it.
Author:  Kent Chasson [ Wed Dec 17, 2008 1:34 am ]
Post subject:  Re: methods for undercutting fretwire for bound fretboards
Another vote for the StewMac nipper.

However, I recall seeing a video of a factory, maybe Tacoma, where they just did them by hand with a file and a very simple jig. The guy was fast too. Way faster than me and my nipper. Of course, I suppose you would be if you did it for hours every day. At least until the carpel tunnel syndrom kicks in.
Author:  Brett L Faust [ Wed Dec 17, 2008 1:47 am ]
Post subject:  Re: methods for undercutting fretwire for bound fretboards
I bought the tang nippers,both sizes. I was never satisfied with the small nubbin of tang left by the cutters [headinwall] .As a result I went back to files only .Along with the file I use a "clamping board" with a radius cut into it (so it won't flatten the radiused fretwire) with an oversize slot for the tang .I ran a screw through the board down into a baseboard trapping the fretwire between .I leave a small bit of wire sticking out with the tang facing up A few strokes with the file ,and by a few I mean 4-7 even with stainless and the tang is completly removed.For me this method is faster and cleaner looking. [:Y:] It worked for me ,I hope it works as well for you.
Author:  tommygoat [ Wed Dec 17, 2008 1:51 am ]
Post subject:  Re: methods for undercutting fretwire for bound fretboards
I bought the Fret Tang Removal Tool from LMI. The nippers work well, but if you're doing regular fret work; this thing is fantastic! Quick and precise with excellent control. If you're only doing a few jobs; patience and basic tools work just as well.

Does anybody else have a problem with those nippers pinching your hand? Ouch! :)
Author:  KiwiCraig [ Wed Dec 17, 2008 6:21 am ]
Post subject:  Re: methods for undercutting fretwire for bound fretboards
My understanding was that you still need to use a file when using the nippers , as a final flush neat fit .

File only . Here's my set-up

Attachment:
call51.jpg


Bretts fixture sounds to be very similar to mine ,with a radius at it's base etc . The brass 1/2 round hold down bar has a fret slot in it which keeps the wire stable when clamped down (screws have wingnuts underneath ) I agree , it doesn't take long and leaves a very tidy fret end

Brett L Faust wrote:
I bought the tang nippers,both sizes. I was never satisfied with the small nubbin of tang left by the cutters [headinwall] .As a result I went back to files only .Along with the file I use a "clamping board" with a radius cut into it (so it won't flatten the radiused fretwire) with an oversize slot for the tang .I ran a screw through the board down into a baseboard trapping the fretwire between .I leave a small bit of wire sticking out with the tang facing up A few strokes with the file ,and by a few I mean 4-7 even with stainless and the tang is completly removed.For me this method is faster and cleaner looking. [:Y:] It worked for me ,I hope it works as well for you.
Author:  phil [ Wed Dec 17, 2008 8:30 am ]
Post subject:  Re: methods for undercutting fretwire for bound fretboards
here's another vote for the stewmac nipper. as you say, it seems a little pricey at first. but does it ever speed up the process and add accuracy at the same time! buy it. you won't regret it. there are a lot of other fretwork tools that you can easily save a pile of money on by improvising with stuff from around your shop, but this one is worth the bucks.
phil
Author:  Hesh [ Wed Dec 17, 2008 8:52 am ]
Post subject:  Re: methods for undercutting fretwire for bound fretboards
Knute Rockne would want me to vote for the nipper - so I will..... :D

The proper tools do seem to go a very long way toward getting consistent, drama free results and the Stew-Mac fret tang nipper is just another of the many tools that though not required do seem to help me with my building.

Prior to having one of these I did it with flush cut pliers and a file but it took longer, at least for me...., and I had some waste too where I messed up and had to start all over.

My nipper leaves very little of a tang if any and I am beginning to think that this is not a bad thing either. I always "tonk" my fret ends at a slight angle toward the edge of the fret board. This sets the fret end with a very slight bend where it presses against the edge of the fret board. If any tang is left I think that it may actually add to the stability of the fret end not unlike a registration pin and it does not show either. Wick in some thin CA to the entire fret and in combination with not having a smooth surface under the fret end and the downward pressure that the "tonking" created and I suspect that the fret ends are even more stable.

This was just one of the many, many tools that I put on the "list" with each guitar that I built and after deciding while doing the requisite operation where the tool could have been used that I would get one someday when I could. Not surprisingly Stew-Mac has a convenient "wish list" section in your personal account to keep track of the things that you want to have at a later date....... How kind of them..... :D

Any way my nipper works very well and I am very glad that I have one.
Author:  Mike OMelia [ Wed Dec 17, 2008 9:02 am ]
Post subject:  Re: methods for undercutting fretwire for bound fretboards
Has anybody besides me noticed that the tang nipper tends to pull the wire to one side? This would depend on the size of the cut. this could be eliminated with guide holes on either side of the cutter, I think.

Mike
Author:  Ricardo [ Wed Dec 17, 2008 9:13 am ]
Post subject:  Re: methods for undercutting fretwire for bound fretboards
My fret cutting plyers seem to do the job just fine without nippers. Occasionally I have to file a bit.
Author:  Michael Dale Payne [ Wed Dec 17, 2008 9:24 am ]
Post subject:  Re: methods for undercutting fretwire for bound fretboards
Mike O'Melia wrote:
Has anybody besides me noticed that the tang nipper tends to pull the wire to one side? This would depend on the size of the cut. this could be eliminated with guide holes on either side of the cutter, I think.

Mike


Mine dont, mine makes a nice quick clean cut with no deformity
Author:  Dave Stewart [ Wed Dec 17, 2008 9:33 am ]
Post subject:  Re: methods for undercutting fretwire for bound fretboards
I've used the "nibbler" tool, which I got from Radio Shack for about $15, for a couple of years & it's worked well. (looks very similar to stewmac tool but you have to file groove - couldn't find reciept/SKU #)
My sequence is measure & mark length, nip off tang (centered on mark), needle file off burr, snip apart at mark (so you now have the tail of the previous fret & one end of the next fret prep'd) & you're done.
Author:  Michael Dale Payne [ Wed Dec 17, 2008 9:42 am ]
Post subject:  Re: methods for undercutting fretwire for bound fretboards
Dave Stewart wrote:
I've used the "nibbler" tool, which I got from Radio Shack for about $15, for a couple of years & it's worked well. (looks very similar to stewmac tool but you have to file groove - couldn't find reciept/SKU #)
My sequence is measure & mark length, nip off tang (centered on mark), needle file off burr, snip apart at mark (so you now have the tail of the previous fret & one end of the next fret prep'd) & you're done.


Radio Shack quit carrying it a while back (at least that was what my local RS rep told me) but if you have a local electronic supply house they are likely to have it. It is a common tool for building custom control boxes.
Author:  Dennis Leahy [ Wed Dec 17, 2008 9:47 am ]
Post subject:  Re: methods for undercutting fretwire for bound fretboards
Will the StewMac model cut EVO or Stainless Steel fret wire?

Dennis
Author:  Rod True [ Wed Dec 17, 2008 10:26 am ]
Post subject:  Re: methods for undercutting fretwire for bound fretboards
Mike, I have no problems with my Stew-Mac fret nipper at all. It cuts right where I want it to and it doesn't leave any of the tang, just a perfectly flat underside of the fret.

It does take a tiny bit of mastery to use (not really) and once I figured out I needed to hold the fret towards the cutter more (we are talking a couple 0.001") the tang was completely removed.

Here's how I do my frets, I pre cut them oversized and put them in a "holder" of sorts with each fret in it's proper place (although I could eliminate this step and just cut, remove the tang and install on each fret individually). Then I nip off one tang end, place it over the fret so the end of the tang butts up to the inside of the binding. Then I note which fret barb is closest to the inside of the opposite binding channel and cut the tang off where It's needed. Then I just check the fit in the slot making sure there is a bit of play between the two bindings. I only try for 1/64"-1/32" undersized for the slot.

Anyway, my fret prep work dramatically improved with accuracy and decreased in time when I got the Stew-Mac fret tang nipper.
Author:  Rod True [ Wed Dec 17, 2008 10:27 am ]
Post subject:  Re: methods for undercutting fretwire for bound fretboards
Dennis Leahy wrote:
Will the StewMac model cut EVO or Stainless Steel fret wire?

Dennis


I don't know for sure, but I would think it would work fine for both.
Author:  Cotton [ Wed Dec 17, 2008 10:30 am ]
Post subject:  Re: methods for undercutting fretwire for bound fretboards
http://www.radioshack.com/product/index ... Id=2289712

This is the link for the Radio Shack nibblers. They're $10.99 online only!
Author:  Cotton [ Wed Dec 17, 2008 10:35 am ]
Post subject:  Re: methods for undercutting fretwire for bound fretboards
I found this link about the Radio Shack nibbler mod.

http://www.kitguitarsforum.com/forum/th ... 12_0_5_0_C
Author:  LiquidGabe [ Wed Dec 17, 2008 10:44 am ]
Post subject:  Re: methods for undercutting fretwire for bound fretboards
My buddy helped me with my first fret job and he had the SM tool. I immediately saw it for what it was, and modified the nibblers I had at home in no more than 3 minutes. You just need a little groove for the side of the fret. They work every bit as well as the SM, though the money saved was spent at SM anyway....
Author:  Rvsgtr [ Wed Dec 17, 2008 12:13 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: methods for undercutting fretwire for bound fretboards
I've done probably close to 100 fret jobs now and I still don't like the Stewmac tool. It will undercut but you still have to file the underside to get the tang flush and get a professional look. If it would cut smooth it would save me 2 hours per fret job I'm sure. But...different strokes for different folks...It still seems quicker to me to undercut with the fret nippers.
Author:  Hesh [ Wed Dec 17, 2008 1:07 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: methods for undercutting fretwire for bound fretboards
You know...... :D it just might matter too who's fret wire and what size we are all using too when it comes to the results that we see. Then again - it may not matter at all.
Author:  Dave Livermore [ Wed Dec 17, 2008 1:19 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: methods for undercutting fretwire for bound fretboards
This tool comes on and goes off my radar a couple times each year.
And every time I look at the price and then clamp the dremel in a vise with a small cut off wheel, put on the goggles, ear protection and gloves and get to work.
It takes about 30 minutes to do all the frets, and must be done outside because those metal filings go everywhere.

Now that it is crazy cold here in MN the tool is back on my radar.

Radio shack is out of stock on it, even online.
However, I found one here for $12
http://www.crazypc.com/products/9140.html

and a Klein Nibbler that looks pretty identical to the one offered by luthier supliers. at Ace Hardware it is around $30
Here's the same thing for $17

http://mro2go.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=49076011Bl

I'm thinking it would be a great stocking stuffer.

Dave
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