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Just finished my Wells/Karol jig. "photo"
http://www.luthiersforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10101&t=19835		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  Lars Stahl [ Sat Nov 29, 2008 3:37 pm ]
Post subject:  Just finished my Wells/Karol jig. "photo"
Ok Just finished my WK jig. I followed Chris Paulics Video as a guide and it works great. Need to fix 1 small thing tomorrow, but its 99% done bliss .

Thanks Chris for the help !!!
your videos are awesome !.

they did not have the plastic you used Chris, so I used this "extremely hard" transparant plastic, and its 20mm thick. the transparency makes the rods in the photo look wierd, but for your notice they are straight :D . I am starting to get fanatic about this haha. so much fun !!!! :mrgreen:
Attachment:
WK_JIG.jpg
Author:  Rod True [ Sat Nov 29, 2008 3:40 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Just finished my Wells/Karol jig. "photo"
Looks good Lars, now we expect to see pictures of your rosette tomorrow :D
Author:  Ennis Guitars [ Sat Nov 29, 2008 3:53 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Just finished my Wells/Karol jig. "photo"
That looks great Lars.
Author:  Hesh [ Sat Nov 29, 2008 4:36 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Just finished my Wells/Karol jig. "photo"
Wow Lars my friend your new jig looks like it could run circles around some of the ones that I have seen.......... laughing6-hehe :D Nice job! [:Y:] [clap] [clap] [clap] [clap]
Author:  Peter J [ Sat Nov 29, 2008 6:17 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Just finished my Wells/Karol jig. "photo"
Nice work Lars !! [clap] I like the thicker plastic and I'm sure that it will serve you well. I notice that you are using the Bosch Colt laminate router. I have two of them and they are great tools. The micro adjust for depth is very good.

Keep up the good work. Only 643 more jigs and fixtures to go..... laughing6-hehe
Author:  Peter J [ Sat Nov 29, 2008 7:31 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Just finished my Wells/Karol jig. "photo"
Nice work Lars !! [clap] I like the thicker plastic and I'm sure that it will serve you well. I notice that you are using the Bosch Colt laminate router. I have two of them and they are great tools. The micro adjust for depth is very good.

Keep up the good work. Only 643 more jigs and fixtures to go..... laughing6-hehe
Author:  WaddyThomson [ Sat Nov 29, 2008 9:01 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Just finished my Wells/Karol jig. "photo"
HERE YOU Go, Filippo.
Author:  Chris Paulick [ Sat Nov 29, 2008 9:20 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Just finished my Wells/Karol jig. "photo"
Looks great ! [clap] [clap] [clap] [:Y:]
You even did the curved front where the pivot pin is. I've decided to just make that the way Sylvan Wells does. I think it's not worth the extra time to do it that way. I would have liked to have had a plexi one. I think it just makes it easier to see what's going on.
Author:  Lars Stahl [ Sat Nov 29, 2008 9:35 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Just finished my Wells/Karol jig. "photo"
Thank you all for the kind words :D . I will send photos and keep you all updated on how my build is giong. !!

I Am a bit scared to cut my first rosette though hmm! the top is only 0.101 about.
:? :shock:

Question !!: is it recommended to cut out the "wood"-rosette before cutting the channels on the top, or the other way around, and then make the rosette from the size of the channes choosen. "the wood for the rosette is on its way here, but I cant wait !! hahaha.
I am making a rosette of macassar bordered both on the outside and inside with "peters and K-Ryans" thin paua strips.!

Lars.
Author:  Rod True [ Sat Nov 29, 2008 9:43 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Just finished my Wells/Karol jig. "photo"
Lars, like most everything we do, practice on scrap first. Even if it's MDF. Actually, it's a good medium to use for practicing rosettes.

Here's how I set the jig up for cutting. I use my digital vernier calipers, measure to the inside of the bit and the pin and dial it in to incredible precision, or measure to the outside of the bit and the outside of the pin and turn the pin out to dial it in to incredible precision.

Just draw out what you want on paper. It doesn't have to be accurate on the paper, just make sure you consider the diameter of the pin and the bit when measuring to set the cut.

Attachment:
faulkes guitar (15).JPG
Author:  Rod True [ Sat Nov 29, 2008 9:46 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Just finished my Wells/Karol jig. "photo"
Again, just practice it all out of scrap materials first Lars. Till you get confident (which won't take long at all) you don't want to mess up any special material. It's easy to cut the channels wrong when thinking about the bit diameter and the pin diameter.

Here's a sketch when cutting the rosette channel in the top.

Attachment:
circle cutter.jpg


Now, it's different when cutting the rosette which is to be inlayed into the top. Just lay everything out and you'll be good to go.

Practice first 8-)
Author:  Lars Stahl [ Sun Nov 30, 2008 5:31 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Just finished my Wells/Karol jig. "photo"
Great advices my friends . ! thank you soooo much, this really helps [:Y:] [:Y:] . will try on some scrap tonight.

Lars.
Author:  SteveSmith [ Sun Nov 30, 2008 7:25 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Just finished my Wells/Karol jig. "photo"
Lars,

Looks good. I think you'll be pleasantly surprised how well the jig will work. My top also is about 0.100". I cut a .040" deep channel using a down-cut spiral bit and it worked perfectly.
Author:  Hesh [ Sun Nov 30, 2008 7:48 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Just finished my Wells/Karol jig. "photo"
Lars buddy I cut the rosette first too and also remove about a 1/4" segment from the top of the rosette (where it will be under the fret board extension and not show) to make it flexible and easy to fit. Then I cut two pieces of purfling that I plan on using. The channel is next to be cut and I remove the circle cutter with it's settings locked firmly in place frequently during the cutting of the channel and vac the channel area where I am cutting. If you don't vac the channel the circle cutter jig starts riding on dust and excess sawdust which makes the bottom of the channel not perfectly flat. Having the bottom of the channel perfectly flat aids in gluing the rosette in place. With your top at about .100 I would cut the channel no more than .050 deep. Cut the rosette from about .070 material and scrape flush with the top after it is glued in place.

When the channel gets close to fitting the rosette I remove the jig and trial fit the rosette and purfling. If it is too snug I remove and use the circle cutter again taking a few thousandths off the rosette channel, outside edge, and trial fit again until it fits. The rosette being split makes it easier to fit in place when the channel and rosette are not a perfect match in radius.

If you are going to use Titebond or LMI white which I do I make the channel wide enough so that the rosette and purfling can be pushed into place with light pressure. These glues will swell the wood and actually help to fill any very small gaps with the wood swelling.

If you are going to use CA, and be sure to seal the top with shellac first, I would make the channel a perfect or near perfect fit since CA won't swell the wood and if any gaps exist you will have gaps to deal with after the CA has cured.

So if you use CA fit the channel to fit perfectly. If you use Titebond or white glue .003ish of extra space in my experience disappears after the glue swells the wood and these glues won't risk staining your top either.

I am not saying not to use CA but I am saying that if you do use CA seal the top and shoot for a more perfect fit. If you use white glue leave a slight amount of play, .003ish, and the wood swelling will make it all fit just right.
Author:  Lars Stahl [ Sun Nov 30, 2008 10:44 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Just finished my Wells/Karol jig. "photo"
Hesh, I will be using titebond ! so your info was warmly welcomed.
I was actually just thinking about these things, glue , bits, etc etc.
Down Cut spiral ? Is this to be used for for larger cuts "in width" or just for the small channels like the BWB etc. What bits am I to use all and all for the rosette ? I thought I could use the bits you use for cutting the bindings !! ?? :shock: :? . also is it prefferably to start cutting from a certain point, like from soundhole and out or the other way ?
I am sorry if I am asking to much now haha. Time has come to the actual guitarbuilding, and I am getting nervous :D .

Lars.
Author:  Hesh [ Sun Nov 30, 2008 10:56 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Just finished my Wells/Karol jig. "photo"
Lars buddy I like spiral down-cut bits for rosettes. I also always start my cuts right smack in the center of the top of the rosette where the fret board extension will hide any........m*stakes....... :D
Author:  Lars Stahl [ Sun Nov 30, 2008 4:07 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Just finished my Wells/Karol jig. "photo"
Thanks, ok then I´ll just head down to the hardware store to get me some downcuts then, I only have regular straight ones. Good advice Hesh to start under the fretboard !

I made my first test run this evening, and it workt GREAT. The jig is superb !!! steady and exact. So, as soon as I get the wood thats coming my way, I´ll start the cut on my first top 8-) :mrgreen: . Cant wait.

quick question ! : as you cut the rosette ( not on the top) then am I supposed to cut it out on one lap, or should I cut it 90% through on the first lap, then the rest, "to make sure its clean" etc. ? ok start laughing :oops: :oops:
Author:  Lars Stahl [ Sun Nov 30, 2008 4:47 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Just finished my Wells/Karol jig. "photo"
Here´s a photo of the test rosette I made . also put up some shelfs for some chisels. and planes. :P
Attachment:
rosette2.jpg
Attachment:
test rosette.jpg
Author:  Lars Stahl [ Mon Dec 01, 2008 10:46 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Just finished my Wells/Karol jig. "photo"
Thanks, ok then I´ll just head down to the hardware store to get me some downcuts then, I only have regular straight ones. Good advice Hesh to start under the fretboard !

I made my first test run this evening, and it workt GREAT. The jig is superb !!! steady and exact. So, as soon as I get the wood thats coming my way, I´ll start the cut on my first top 8-) :mrgreen: . Cant wait.

quick question ! : as you cut the rosette ( not on the top) then am I supposed to cut it out on one lap, or should I cut it 90% through on the first lap, then the rest, "to make sure its clean" etc. ? ok start laughing :oops: :oops:
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