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Archtop Tailpiece Design http://www.luthiersforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10101&t=15862	Page 1 of 1

Author:	JackBarton [ Tue Feb 12, 2008 12:58 pm ]
Post subject:	Archtop Tailpiece Design
I've been trying to sketch out some designs for a tailpiece. I'm not doing the Sacconi thing for a few different reasons, so my two elements are ebony and some kind of metal bracket. Are there any guys on here that use this style? What metal is used? Is Aluminum ok? What methods do you use for cutting and shaping the metal? Do you color it? I'd love to hear anyone's approach on this. It seems like almost everyone is using the Sacconi these days.

Author:	Anthony Z [ Tue Feb 12, 2008 1:53 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Archtop Tailpiece Design
Jack, I've abandoned the sacconi tailpiece as well. I now use a hinged ebony tailpiece (similar to that of Tom Ribbecke's design). Those that I know that are doing a combo metal/ebony tailpiece use brass. The brass is easily bent to shape. Beauty is that it is so pliable that if you get the angle wrong it is easy to fix. You can cut brass easily with a bandsaw or a jig saw. Probably best to use a metal cutting blade for either. I remember seeing one of Howard Klepper's years ago. I think he used a hardware store variety hinge and coloured it black with a Sharpie. The MIMF library has a bunch of info on Archtop bridges. Might be worth a look!

Author:	Brad Goodman [ Tue Feb 12, 2008 3:40 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Archtop Tailpiece Design
Hi Jack, I use an ebony tailpiece with a brass bracket that I fabricate myself. Basically I bend a piece of brass then use machine screws from underneath to anchor it to the tailpiece.I use a tap to thread the holes in the ebony-works great.

Author:	Anthony Z [ Tue Feb 12, 2008 4:00 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Archtop Tailpiece Design
Here is a useful link to the http://www.mimf.com/library/sacconi_tailpiece_adjuster.htm that will give you some good ideas.

Author:	Louis Freilicher [ Tue Feb 12, 2008 4:47 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Archtop Tailpiece Design
I took some pictures of the last tailpiece I built to make up a tutorial on this subject, but ran out of roundtuits. I like to use butler tray hinges for my tailpieces. They are available from woodcraft of your local hardware place. They look like this: The one on the left is stock and on the right is one I started to modify already. They are designed to close and lock into this position. If you hack off the little piece of steel that locks them open you can swing they the other way and with a little grinding have yourself a really nice hinge for a tailpiece.

Author:	Anthony Z [ Tue Feb 12, 2008 4:51 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Archtop Tailpiece Design
Very nice Louis!

Author:	JackBarton [ Tue Feb 12, 2008 5:12 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Archtop Tailpiece Design
That's great Louis! Nicely done. I had just about decided to abandon the hinge approach in favor of bending, but now I'll have to rethink things! How do you guys do the finer shaping of your pieces? I'll probably use a belt sander. Think that will suffice?

Author:	Louis Freilicher [ Tue Feb 12, 2008 7:13 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Archtop Tailpiece Design
Thanks All! A belt sander will do just fine but a bench grinder would be quicker. The butler tray hinge need some parts squared up, like the bit that will wind up sitting on top of your binding. If your sander doesn’t do sharp corners well you could hit these spots with a burr in dremel tool and finish it off with a file. Brass is my favorite metal to work with because it machines beautifly and looks fantastic polished out. Louis

Author:	npalen [ Wed Feb 13, 2008 7:40 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Archtop Tailpiece Design
There was a discussion (many moons ago) about whether a bent tailpiece strap could be strong enough to adjust the string breakover angle. Nelson

Author:	Brad Goodman [ Thu Feb 14, 2008 9:29 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Archtop Tailpiece Design
Nelson, I'm not sure what you mean. I use a solid piece of brass and it works fine.

Author:	npalen [ Thu Feb 14, 2008 10:55 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Archtop Tailpiece Design
Brad--I didnt' state it very well. The idea was to make the breakover angle adjustable by simply changing the bend angle on the metal strap. The strap would have to be strong enough to hold it's bent position as the string pull would be trying to make it align. Changing the breakover angle of the strings over the bridge theoretically changes the loading on the top plate. This would, again theoretically, change the sound. Am I making sense. Nelson

Author:	Brad Goodman [ Thu Feb 14, 2008 1:25 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Archtop Tailpiece Design
Nelson, Yes now I understand. As I'm sure you have seen,D'aquisto and others used an adjustable metal bracket to change the angle of the break over the bridge. The way I do it you can't change it because the brass strap is not strong enough.

Author:	Anthony Z [ Thu Feb 14, 2008 9:03 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Archtop Tailpiece Design
Nelson, do you remember this is the brass/ebony tailpiece combo you sent me many moons ago. Very elegant design!

Author:	npalen [ Thu Feb 14, 2008 10:12 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Archtop Tailpiece Design
Hi Anthony! I had forgotten about that one. It is really a slick design. I wish my memory was half as good as yours. Seems like the "moons" are going by way too fast these days. Nelson P.S. I DO remember telling you a while back the reason I keep building archtops. I forget how much work it was building a bunch by the time I get them all finished and then start another 10 or so because of memory loss.

Author:	calgarc [ Fri Aug 20, 2010 1:39 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Archtop Tailpiece Design
have you ever though of using a ball mount like the ones kent parker uses on his archtops. you can even make one out of wood

Author:	DannyV [ Sat Aug 21, 2010 11:13 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Archtop Tailpiece Design
It seems that the Sacconi strap is a bit of a dead horse. I'm just curious why? I'm thinking about an arch top soon and picked up a strap and bridge. It's great having you guys around for inspiration. There's not much sexier than a well done archtop IMHO. Cheers, Danny

Author:	Darrel Friesen [ Sat Aug 21, 2010 1:03 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Archtop Tailpiece Design
I've used the Sacconi style cable for four of my archtops Danny. It's the braided steel one sold by Stew Mac, not the nylon one. Definitely works well. Some people don't like the idea of the Benedetto style tailpiece fulcrum resting on the top, but there are ways around it. It's a preference thing IMO.

Author:	elysne [ Mon Aug 23, 2010 2:32 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Archtop Tailpiece Design
I use the Benedetto style tail-piece on my archtops. The critical issue is tweaking the deisgn and being very accurate with all the cuts etc. I now cut mine on my CNC and have greatly improved, at least in my mind, the usability. Getting the notches right where the Sarconi nuts sit underneath and leaving enough material to so the unit holds up well is the biggest challenge. I also remove material underneath from the middle of the tailpiece to lighten the piece.

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