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I also would like to know more about gun cleaning and all the little details of this stuff. A finish that I can spray with a little safety equipment and get a cure within minutes - from home - without a UV light...well it's almost too good to be true. That is, IF it doesn't look like plastic, which some finishes look like to me.

_________________
"I want to know what kind of pickups Vince Gill uses in his Tele, because if I had those, as good of a player as I am, I'm sure I could make it sound like that.
Only badly."

I'll try to answer all the questions.

Gun cleaning, I suppose you could leave it in the gun forever, as long as it isn't exposed to UV. For convinence I use 3M PPS cups for all finishing. I remove the cup after spraying a coat, cap it, and run a little MEK through my gun. I think (good) acetone will work for cleanup too.

Amount for a guitar. I'd say you could get at least 4 bodies and necks out of a quart. I've got 1/2 quart left after one, but I done a bunch of experimenting. It hardly shrinks at all, so it doesn't take may coats. It's pretty thick as shipped. I thin it some with MEK before spraying. Obviously type of spraying equipment, and spray technique/ methods would influence how much you use as well as how thick or thin you want to spray (or brush) it. It's ~95% solids as shipped so there's virtually no shrinkage. After I thin it to suit my style and equipment (~40% MEK) it's ~55% solids. The finish pictured is 4 coats, and it's 4 mils thick after buffing. It really builds fast. If I didn't thin is as much it would build faster.

David, even though no one at solarez says it, I believe adhesion could be affected if it's cured too soon. It seemed that way to me on my experiments. It builds really fast, and flows out really good. There's no need to spray it thick enough to risk runs.......but it's also easy to just brush out any runs, or pick out any dust specks before curing.

Andy, it won't ever cure if it isn't exposed to UV. Polyester is toxic stuff, you need local exhaust to get it away, or your spraying area will be forever toxic. Proper safety equipment is a must. I consider all of you to be friends, and want all of you around....forever. Google "styrene" or "vinyl benzene" to see what you'll be dealing with.

Don, I'm sure some would consider it to look like plastic. It's polyester. My words, or description is Nitro looks like glass, Polyester looks like it's under glass. It looks like a gloss finished Taylor. PM or e-mail me if you want me to send you a piece of scrap I experimented with. You could see the finish on wood in person.

_________________
I didn't mean to say it, but I meant what I said.
http://www.brackettinstruments.com/

Wood, I spray in my garage in a full tyvek suit and respirator. Do you think being in the garage with the garage door open would constitute as UV exposure?

James - I think indirect (reflected) UV rays can cure the resin, so you may want to hang a curtain or some other opaque barrier between your spray area and the garage door. In this video, in which a guy is fiberglassing a surfboard with Solarez polyester resin, he drops a curtain before he works with the resin for that reason.

http://youtu.be/BTpq5tsMkMo

Like Charlie said, I think a curtain would be a good idea. There's a window in my booth. I covered it up just to be sure. The outside of my fan shutters has an awning over it.

_________________
I didn't mean to say it, but I meant what I said.
http://www.brackettinstruments.com/

This looks like a really cool finish. I think I'm going to try it. How many guitars have you finished with this product? Do you wait the 30 minutes for it to flow out and or be absorbed into the wood? Doesn't seem like it would take long to brush on if that was the method of application.

David I've finished one guitar with this stuff. The one pictured at the first of this thread. I let if off gas 30 minutes before curing. My standard finish for bodies is oil Varnish. I've finished a few guitars, and a bunch of necks with catalyzed polyester, but this, as well as a bunch of testing on scrap is my first use of Solarez.

_________________
I didn't mean to say it, but I meant what I said.
http://www.brackettinstruments.com/

I did a Koa/Sitka uke this week with Solarez, 3 coats and buffed in the same day.
But when I did the FB I taped it off with the 3M green tape, Bad choice.
I guess something in the tape adheisive did not like the Solarez as the edge of the FB would not cure. Tried it 3 times..
Changed to the Blue 3M tape from Home Depot and the finish set up in 2 minutes..


Gary

Gary, Did you spray or brush the Solarez? Got any photos?

So, I went to the site and have a few questions.

Are you using the Gloss Resin as your finish? (Solarez is a brand, not a product, they have many products)

Are you using the photoinitiator? Or is that already in the resin?

Apparently, the photoinitiator can be used in any polyester resin that is unsaturated... true?

Is the resin explosive? (vapors)

Mike

Mike - it's the Gloss resin and the photoinitiator is already in it. No need to add any additional.

Thanks. I was wondering if the vapors or overspray were explosive, thus requiring explosion proof fans, etc. I understrand getting the overspray out due to toxicity.

Of course, this begs another question. If the fan and booth removes the toxic overspray, surely the booth is designed to capture it with filters, correct? One is not just going to move the problem outdoors, right?

Mike

Here are a couple pics of the Uke.
It is the Gloss resin also, just used the wrong name.
It has a strong smell but I brushed it on so the open time of the container was real short.
The tape I used that didn't let it cure was 3M2060
Sands good with no loading on the paper too.

Buffs out real nice also..

Gary

Gary, in your pics, both, there is an area in the lower left of the uke that has a different sheen. I see it in both pics. Is that a photographic artifact?

Mike

EDIT: Never mind, I see you sanded there to show how it buffs after sanded.

I think it is a reflection of my shoulder..

Gary - the uke looks great! Did you by chance measure the finish thickness? I'm curious to know how thick 3 brushed coats ends up after buffing. I've been playing around with Solarez too and plan to try it on my next build. Did you cure between coats? Any other details you'd be willing to share that would help with brushing this product would be appreciated.

So, if this stuff has such low VOC's, can it be sprayed in a non explosion proof environment?

Been asking same thing.

I was asking about this somewhere else. Does not make sense to me that you could cure between coats since the UV cure crosslinks the finish.

I cured between coats, it adheared well to the previous coat too.
I don't know how thich but I will check when I clean off for the bridge.
Don't know about VOC's but one problem I can see with spraying is it is like a fiberglas resin and it stays stick for a long time.

I brushed a coat, let sit for 10 minutes then brought it outside to cure for 3 minutes.
Sanded flat with 400 and did the same 2 more times. Sanding the last time I used 500 grit and went up th 1500 then buffed.

I would like to try spraying but I don't have a booth in the basement to do that.. I think the finish would be a lot smooother with spraying and less sanding to level.

Gary

Gary, do you thin it at all, or brush straight out of the can? What type of brush?

_________________
"I want to know what kind of pickups Vince Gill uses in his Tele, because if I had those, as good of a player as I am, I'm sure I could make it sound like that.
Only badly."

Foam brush Right out of the plastic jug.
If you want to drive up here I can give you some to play with...

Here's the MSDS for Solarez Polyester Resin.
http://solarez.com/MSDS/MSDS%20Solarez.pdf

The flammability rating is "3", same as a bunch of solvent based finishes. I believe to recieve a "3" rating the flash point has to be under 100F. The flash point on this finish is 86F. For the sake of comparison the flash point for Nitrocellouse Lacquer is 24F. The flash point for Zinsser Seal Coat is 55F. The flash point for the oil based Varnish I use alot is 56F. Explosion wise, it's alot safer than Nitro, and somewhat safer than even shellac, or oil Varnish. IMHO the bigger risk with this finish is to your lungs, liver, and brain.

Don't breathe this stuff, don't get it on your skin. I use a hooded respirator, Tyvek suit, and nitrile gloves for spraying. I recommend splash proof goggles, a organic vapor resiprator, and gloves for brushing.

"Fiberglass resin" found in the little fiberglass repair kits a big box stores is actually polyester resin. The difference, if I understand correctly is "gloss" polyester resin is ground finer for a better sheen. I would recommend using the "Gloss" resin for guitar finishing, instead of the laminating, or "regular" resin if you're going to use Solarez.


Added, I thin it with MEK for spraying. This probably adds some to the flammibility.


Added more, Gary, for a smoother brushed finish you could thin it a little with MEK, and let if flow out longer before curing (30 minutes). A dust free area would be important for this. If you have any dust specs take a pair of tweezers and pick them out. If you don't have to sand between coats for smoothness you can expose to to the sun for ~1 minute to partually cure it, then add another coat to the almost cured but still tacky surface.

_________________
I didn't mean to say it, but I meant what I said.
http://www.brackettinstruments.com/

Great information Woody. I'm going to have to try this stuff. Looks like I'll be opening up that new Tyvek suit and wearing the respirator. I just have to figure out how to get the fumes out of the shop. Maybe it's time for a good fan...

_________________
"I want to know what kind of pickups Vince Gill uses in his Tele, because if I had those, as good of a player as I am, I'm sure I could make it sound like that.
Only badly."

Sounds good Woody,
I will have to try that next time with the 1 minute of curing.

Gary